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Language Bernd 09/23/2019 (Mon) 22:01:49 [Preview] No. 29287
Let us create a language thus we can protect what we say from outsiders.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 05:34:47 [Preview] No.29291 del
Lernu esperanton.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 05:53:30 [Preview] No.29296 del
(25.20 KB 406x274 te.jpg)
Sounds kinda cool. It could work. Krautician language possibly? Berndenian?

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 05:56:25 [Preview] No.29298 del
Albanian would also work. I don't think any Albanians on the chans.
Making up a new language, you need someone with ultra high autism. Liek Tolkien. Or Slovborg.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 06:02:02 [Preview] No.29299 del
>Making up a new language, you need someone with ultra high autism.
>you need someone with ultra high autism.

Seems like we got half the job done already! Good stuff! 100% support this

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 07:20:49 [Preview] No.29307 del
In making a language you normally borrow from other languages and make your language distinct. For instance the english language contains norse, latin, french and celtic as well. Plus I think it would be easier using the latin alphabet. Example the word autumn.
In japanese - Aki
In gaelic(scottish) - Foghar

In say Berndenian we can make the word harki. I.e a simple combination of two seperate words can go a long way in forming a language. Then we next have to focus on how a sentence is structured. Probably the normal way. Or if you want to have an extra layer of difficulty we could always do the hebrew way of writing.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 07:44:33 [Preview] No.29308 del
You can even write like this.
In polish the word for me is mnie
In ancient greek the work for me is ou
in portuguese the word for me is mim
Berndenian language mnimou - me(in English)

The word for love in romanian is lumesc
The word for love in finnish is armastella
The word for love in uzbek is svegi
The word for love in berndenian is lumestelgi.

In a sentence it could simply go like this
mnimou lumestelgi harki. Or if you really want to be a troll

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 07:50:14 [Preview] No.29309 del
well armastella is to love in finnish but it still gets my point across. I probably screwed up so many times there however if we combine words creating a language isn't nearly as difficult as it sounds we just need the effort, dedication and time.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 08:25:14 [Preview] No.29311 del
I have a suggestion. In cymraeg (the language of Wales) many English words have been adopted into the old Celtic tongue. To do this they begin with an alphabet that is completely phonetic, as in every character is always pronounced the same, then they simply spell the word so it sounds roughly the same as it does in English read aloud.
We can create our own in this manner using using unique characters from any existing language, Cyrillic even, though I highly suggest we keep it small for simplicity sake, perhaps around 24 characters with no duplicate sounds.

Welsh alphabet:
a b c ch d dd e f ff g ng h i j l ll m n o p ph r rh s t th u w y

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 08:34:52 [Preview] No.29312 del
Also a non English grammar! Sorry, but that's a must! I forgot to say, English grammar is shit and confusing. Instead we should use descriptions after names like a sensible language, ie dog brown.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 08:47:04 [Preview] No.29313 del
I'm not familar with the welsh language so I can't really make a good choice here. Can you give an example?
I mean I get where your coming from. However most people here are used to saying pretty women not women pretty.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 11:19:33 [Preview] No.29317 del
>I'm not familar with the welsh language so I can't really make a good choice here. Can you give an example?
Well, I'm not suggesting we actually speak welsh but just for ecsampl, pinc.
Actwali, fwc tis aedea lol. Ae dwnt now, ut maet wrc.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 11:21:39 [Preview] No.29318 del
(1.02 MB 640x360 videoplayback.mp4)
Sorry, forgot the alphabet song.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 11:24:00 [Preview] No.29320 del
Ofcourse the vowels are a e i o u w y

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 12:01:56 [Preview] No.29321 del
So something like victoria would be written like fficthoria.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 13:28:48 [Preview] No.29325 del
more like fictorua

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 13:51:04 [Preview] No.29326 del
Alright I think i'm beginning to understand. I was thinking to keep it simple but difficult to understand.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 14:59:55 [Preview] No.29327 del
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I tried learning some Welsh while in Wales, but most of the locals (at least those who knew it themselves) would just start speaking English to me, probably because I was so bad at it.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 15:14:24 [Preview] No.29328 del
Yeah I was thinking of keeping the original english alphabet. Hence my original idea was just to combine words of different languages to create smething new.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 15:18:23 [Preview] No.29329 del
Well my point is, once we start to replace characters in berndese we can make it look however we want, but establishing a new alphabet will be our phonetic cipher. So it doesn't have to look the way welsh does, it could just look like:

as dhxcv bij io sakl sdretjkl

So all you have to do is learn the alphabet and you can read. Hence keeping it limited in characters to make it simple.

I just speak whatever I like. Even in english I rarely care what others are saying anyway. A couple welsh people got angry at me once for not pronouncing things correctly but I just kept talking. I can pronounce lots better now anyway.
Bachgen da am trio. The tongue tricks take some time but it's always great to see people try things.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 15:38:19 [Preview] No.29332 del
I get what you mean however I believe it is a smart idea to begin with something simple then modify the entire language through time. After all most languages begin as another language and then begin to divert. If we begin with say combining multiples of the same word from differing languages. Unless you want to go full country maker and found a new country. Then the new language should be simple yet difficult to understand.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 16:58:28 [Preview] No.29336 del
You wrote a lot. Will read sometimes.
I advise making the language agglutinative to make indos- you mad.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 18:58:59 [Preview] No.29344 del
Maybe start with vowels first and then take it from there

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 19:15:32 [Preview] No.29345 del
I think a, e, i, o, u is simple and gets to the point. We could always do a hebrew and have no vowels

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 19:18:25 [Preview] No.29346 del
Another suggestion: Sumerian.
It has the added benefit that a cuneiform sign can have even over 100 meanings so sentences can be formed such way that they have several different translations. I can recall something I heard/read somewhere their texts frequently were drafted so they have a layer of naughty stuff in it. Liek:
"En-Lil went to the beach of the lake" can also read as "En-Lil had wild sex with the XY goddess".
Sadly I can't give a source.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 19:29:56 [Preview] No.29347 del
>Let us create a language thus we can protect what we say from outsiders.
KC lingo already does this to some extent.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 19:57:14 [Preview] No.29351 del
Three cups of three.

Bernd 09/24/2019 (Tue) 22:18:01 [Preview] No.29355 del
I'm a christian the example makes me wreathe with anger plus I think sumerian would be too difficult to learn

Bernd 09/25/2019 (Wed) 06:48:00 [Preview] No.29365 del
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Could this be the first onomatopoeia of the Bernd language?


I mean if we already made a magazine, I'm sure we can make our own language.

Bernd 09/25/2019 (Wed) 07:38:40 [Preview] No.29366 del
Here's a start

a - pronounced aaa
ap - pronounced aff
b - pronounced be
c - pronounced cay
d - pronounced dee
e - pronounced i
f - pronounced eff
g - pronounced ge
gr - pronouced ger
h - pronounced hu
j - pronounced jey
l - pronounced al
ln - pronounced alon
m - pronounced mu
n - pronounced n
o - pronounced o
p - pronounced pay
ps - pronounced pass
r - pronounced qu
s - pronounced es
t - pronounced ti
tf - pronounced taf
u - pronounced oo
x - pronounced ek
xn - pronounced ekine
y - pronounced iy
yg - pronounced yig

this is just a building block.

Bernd 09/25/2019 (Wed) 17:31:48 [Preview] No.29375 del
Sounds good. Will there be a q letter or any accented letters?

Bernd 09/25/2019 (Wed) 18:17:54 [Preview] No.29376 del
Why would anyone in their right mind pronounce ap as aff?
Not to mention e as i.
Also separate aff and eff? For what purpose? In the old Hungarian alphabet, "runes", a couple of letters had an a- and e- version which basically signified low and high "vocalization" because Hungarian has vowel harmony and when they wrote old old script they could leave out the vowels and this could give directions for a whole word how to read it. But in this case there's literally no need.

Bernd 09/25/2019 (Wed) 20:26:26 [Preview] No.29378 del
ap as in raphael instead of rafael. What would you recommend the alphabet to be?

Bernd 09/26/2019 (Thu) 05:30:37 [Preview] No.29380 del
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I'd use a simpler one, no need for gr pronounced ger if we already have g, e and r sounds (and letters representing them) to build that group of sounds.

But I have a better idea for building words. Let's base it onto "word-bushes". A word-bush is a group of words to identify seemingly unrelated objects/concepts/etc. which belong together via certain inherent properties and this similarity is the basis of naming them and their name (or parts of their name) sounds also similar.
Here's an example, I hope you indos- will get it.
box - an angular object, empty inside for storing stuff
box of matches - a box for storing matches
matchbox - a rolling toy the size of a box of matches
car - a large box for moving people, rolls
So here's an example naming scheme:
box -> boxmatches
box -> boxcar
boxcar & boxmatches -> boxmatchescar
But we don't need to keep whole words, just use a root, and add only one/two sounds:
bo -> bom
bo -> bor (boar?)
bom & bor -> bomor (bomar?)
I will go on with this example and will draw diagram, because box isn't really a root, it can be traced back to cube and that to a square as a most simplistic form. So first the square needs to be named and then related objects/concepts (for example concept itself can be named after box, it's an empty thing for storing thoghts) could be built from it.

Bernd 09/26/2019 (Thu) 06:23:17 [Preview] No.29385 del
Honestly I don't get it.

Bernd 09/26/2019 (Thu) 15:18:57 [Preview] No.29390 del
Planning to write a better explanation. I was hasty in the morn.

Bernd 09/26/2019 (Thu) 19:07:12 [Preview] No.29392 del
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Ok. Here it goes.
Creating words via "word-bushes" is creating words via abstraction and association. It's called a word-bush because the words are stemming from a root and branching from their parents in a bush-like fashion if we wish to draw their relations. It looks similar to the family-tree, oftentimes languages are imagined and portrayed as such, one language stemming from another.
Instead of taking a word, looking up it's translations to several languages, then hacking pieces from those words and stitching them together into monstrosities, this way we could "grow" words from each other.
The basis of this "growth" is the relations between the ideas of the things we want to name. Naming: creating a word for a thing - e.g. the name of "an angular object with empty space inside and what we use for storage" is "box".
This relation is based on the abstract properties of the things.

Bernd 09/26/2019 (Thu) 19:07:56 [Preview] No.29393 del
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Properties of a box are: being angular, empty inside, and we put/store stuff in it. Now comes the abstraction: we take this properties and see what other things they characterize. Let's say another item has these, but also has additional properties, e.g. it can roll around, it's for transportation, it makes noises when used, etc. It's clearly a different thing than a box but also bears the properties of a box. In English they call it a "car". But how about we make a word that reflects the similarity to a box, but also implies that this thing bears additional functions. So call it a boxcar.
But we want usable words and not compound words, especially because in time these words can grow ginormous. We don't want to stick whole words to each other, only letters or syllables.
Root words are the most basic words covering the most basic concepts which all the other concepts - and with them words - are growing from. Root words are also as simple as a syllable or even a letter.
So let's call our "angular, empty thing we put/store things in" a bo. And let's say the word bo contains all these abstract properties.

Bernd 09/26/2019 (Thu) 19:08:37 [Preview] No.29394 del
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Then we associate the additional properties of the thing - which is bo, but also "rolls, transports and roars" - with the sound (and in writing: letter) r. And we call the whole thing a bor bo+r.
And now from the root one branch grew.
Other things are characterized by those properties that are true for boxes and cars, they all bo and r but also other characteristics are true to them. One type of them is big and can hold/transport many people. In English that thing is called "bus". But instead calling it a "boxcarbus" we - again - condense these additional properties into one letter or syllable: s or us. Then we unite this with the previously mentioned properties, by gluing it to their end: bors or borus, whatever you like, let's go with the latter.

Bernd 09/26/2019 (Thu) 19:09:20 [Preview] No.29395 del
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At this point our word-bush looks like this: bo -> bor -> borus. Well, this is quite boring, additional branching, forks would be nice.

So other things which bo and r are also big and can move cargo, i.e. lorries and trucks. Why not represent this property with c or oc? So it bor but also c or oc: borc/boroc. Why not borusc? Because it doesn't transport people now we ignore transporting illegals, so the us isn't needed.

Now the word-bush is:
bo -> bor -> borus
-> boroc

Let's make another branch from the root.
A little bo witm fire lighting sticks stored in it. bo + m. So the bush:
bo -> bor -> borus
-> boroc
-> bom

And so on, and so on.

Bernd 09/26/2019 (Thu) 20:12:55 [Preview] No.29396 del
So it is similar to my idea except we take a concept and roll with it. So for instant an insect we would call
ins then we would add on stuff like
insp for a wasp
insper for a paper wasp
I like the idea.

Bernd 09/27/2019 (Fri) 02:29:59 [Preview] No.29397 del
>Star Trek TNG
>communist race destroying tv show but has good language episode
You dudes need to start with concepts.
For example if I say
"John Kennedy, at, Dallas"
You would immediately due to the man and the context and the epicness of history, picture someone surrounded by kikes, who want to kill him. As was the case with JFK when he was murdered in Dallas.
See? Language is conceptual so I just wanted to point that out. Other examples would be, Trump at UN and you would think immediately how he said socialism is for total faggots and that only patriots would hold the future. So again, concepts.
It was a pretty good episode in terms of communication.

Bernd 09/27/2019 (Fri) 05:12:59 [Preview] No.29398 del
Similar but we aren't constricted by the languages (and their vocabulary) of the Earth. I used the English naming scheme as a basis for better understanding.
Every sound can be associated with a meaning. And I mean pure sounds too, in the case of consonants these are sounds pronounced without an auxiliary vowel (so when saying b just pronounce the sound and not bee). And this meaning can be the subject of abstraction to expand it's use.
About this meaning I'll write an example in the eve.

Also I'm sorry but my grammatical vocabulary is seriously lacking. Maybe there are things that I could write more clear with the precise terms.
Also I heard about this "word-bush" stuff once or twice, long ago and not even the whole thing, so part of it just rationalizations for myself how the authors of the idea could have thought based on what I know about those people believe. There supposed to be books about it somewhere.

Yes, when I talking about "properties" of a thing I mean that collection of characteristics which covers the idea of the thing, all the "boxiness" or "cariness".

Bernd 09/27/2019 (Fri) 20:44:56 [Preview] No.29402 del
Brits here might be onto something tho.
One can never know when a secret language can come in handy.
People created such for a reason.
Languages aren't the only way to hide a message.
Some other ways exist to do that.
Can Bernd tell a few?
Help a fellow out.
Explanations are welcomed.
Cooler solution the better.
Keeping it theoretical, not having actual experience in it isn't a problem.
But it's always good if one knows what's he talking about.
Unfortunately I'm too sleepy just to follow myself.
Neither can keep going forever making stuff up for some reason.
Knaves might be about so I decided to write this.
Explanation I won't give sadly.
Right now I'm just glad I finished this shit.

Bernd 09/27/2019 (Fri) 20:45:45 [Preview] No.29403 del
Oh, I didn't wrote about this. Sorry. On the weekend. Maybe will try and find a book too.

Bernd 09/28/2019 (Sat) 16:18:25 [Preview] No.29409 del
I've already kinda done this

Bernd 09/28/2019 (Sat) 16:56:49 [Preview] No.29412 del
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This is Yautja code which I adapted from material I found online

Bernd 09/29/2019 (Sun) 06:53:39 [Preview] No.29419 del
Oh, Predator! I wasn't sure where I saw that before. Splendid!

Bernd 09/29/2019 (Sun) 14:12:52 [Preview] No.29422 del
The really interesting thing with it is that since there's 10 digits and we have 10 fingers, the upper and lower 5 can represent the 2 hands, effectively forming a new sign language

Bernd 09/29/2019 (Sun) 18:10:38 [Preview] No.29423 del
Is there a logic behind how the numbers are displayed? Or was just randomly chosen by the creators?

So sounds themselves can hold a whole palette of meaning. Let's say we bound to the "r" in example the properties of rolling, transporting, roaring. It signals something which makes mechanical noise, something with an engine.
But we can go further in our abstraction and we can use it for other loud noises, thunder, or for the speakers of a hifi system. Or shouting, and purring noises, we might even want to use it to refer to a cat (with other sounds that express catiness). It can mean resonance (sound waves), but also used to things which (in abstract way) "resonates" well with us or the other way, they are unpleasant.
So we can make a building block out of the sounds which could be used in great many words like legos.
So we don't just look at a thing we want to create a word for, pick a letter from it's "name" (in whatever language) and glue it to the name of a similar thing we already done with.

Bernd 09/30/2019 (Mon) 09:36:06 [Preview] No.29433 del
If you really want to go that route, we need to start with the vowel sounds, long and short

a - ah ayy
e - eh eeh
i - ih eye
o - oh owh
u - uh ooh

That's already ten phonetic characters

b - buh
c - ceh
d - duh
f - fff
g - guh
h - heh
j - juh
/k - kuh ceh
l - lll
m - mmm
n - nnn
p - puh
/q - ceh ooh uh
r - rrr
s - sss
t - teh
v - vvv
/w - wuh - ooh uh
/x - eh ceh sss
/y - yuh - eeh uh
/z - teh sss

Then we can eliminate characters that can be spelt phonetically with other characters that's another fifteen

ch th ng

Plus three special characters.

a - ah
? ai - ayy - ah eeh
e - eh
? ee i - eeh
i - ih
? i - eye - uh eeh
o - oh
? ow - owh - oh ooh
u - uh
? oo - ooh

b - buh
c - ceh
d - duh
f - fff
g - guh
h - heh
j - juh
l - lll
m - mmm
n - nnn
p - puh
r - rrr
s - sss
t - teh
v - vvv

? - ch
? - th
? - ng

Last we assign our characters to the phonetic sounds, then we have our cypher. If we learn the alphabet we should be able to read and write the language which will sound like English, although slightly broken like a foreigner might use. However in theory we/I should be able to write a translation script in python/whatever to aid learners.
As for what characters you would like assigned, we could stick to what's readily available on the keyboard or even toss in a few special characters, just to fuck with things more. The standard qwerty already has many characters on it like `¬%^&*_+{}[email protected]:<>/#[]

Bernd 10/01/2019 (Tue) 18:12:08 [Preview] No.29449 del
(140.34 KB 993x740 languages.png)
I don't know if it was much logical in the movies, but it seemed like 10 segments would make sense
In the AVP2 game there are 9 segments displayed, so my variant has one extra segment but is otherwise just about the same, I thought about using the 10th segment for extra letters like ð, æ and ö to make them more distinguishable

I just found this pic and was looking at some language stuff


Bernd 10/01/2019 (Tue) 18:37:36 [Preview] No.29451 del
>I don't know if it was much logical in the movies,
I would bet 10 HUF that it was aesthetical decision. Sadly.

Picking a link from the link:

Bernd 10/01/2019 (Tue) 22:44:46 [Preview] No.29455 del
That chart is missing both baltic and slavic languages... Would armenian also count?

Bernd 10/02/2019 (Wed) 15:47:27 [Preview] No.29457 del
How those are pronounced in a human language? Could you post them in IPA?

Bernd 10/02/2019 (Wed) 15:50:23 [Preview] No.29458 del
That only shows Centum Languages.

Bernd 10/02/2019 (Wed) 20:34:59 [Preview] No.29462 del
How about we all speak Gaulish and write it down in an abjad like Arabic or Hebrew so that nobody could recognise it?

Bernd 10/03/2019 (Thu) 05:01:23 [Preview] No.29463 del
+1 I know goulash.

Bernd 10/03/2019 (Thu) 09:37:13 [Preview] No.29465 del
I also know goolies

Let me see if I can find a mic first

Bernd 10/03/2019 (Thu) 15:53:55 [Preview] No.29466 del
You can just check a table with IPA characters.

Bernd 10/03/2019 (Thu) 17:09:09 [Preview] No.29469 del
(68.80 KB 800x615 assburger call.jpg)
Really liking this thread so far. Especially this >>29433

If you guys want, I can make a draft for a pdf containing almost everything so far in this thread. We can have something similar to Kohlzine here. Lemme know what you all think of it

>t. illustrator

Bernd 10/07/2019 (Mon) 09:28:34 [Preview] No.29518 del
a - æ pad
a - eɪ made
e - ɛ bet
e - iː real
i - ɪ lid
i - aɪ ride
o - ɒ pot
o - oʊ code
u - ʌ bud
u - uː cruel

b - b buy
c - k cry
d - d dye
f - f fry
g - ɡ guy
h - h high
j - ʤ jew
l - l lie
m - m my
n - n nigh
p - p pie
r - r rye
s - s sigh
t - t tie
v - v vie

th - θ broth
ng - ŋ sang
sh - ʃ cash

/ch - tʃ
/k - k
/q - kuːʌ
/w - uːʌ
/x - ɛks
/y - iːʌ
/z - ts

Bernd 10/07/2019 (Mon) 09:44:41 [Preview] No.29519 del
Thanks for showing me the IPA, I hadn't heard of it before. Funny, it showed me I'd made a mistake and left out 'sh' but could spell 'ch' with 't' and 'sh' so improvements made thanks to your suggestion.
Sorry I didn't get a chance to do it before now, I only just got the time off.

So I guess now we assign characters to each sound. Shall we say, one suggestion per post? Please, no greedy bernds, one suggestion to a bernd if possible. All suggestions will be open to debate and change as we progress. I or some other bernd can update the agreed list as we go.

Also, I hope I'm not treading on other bernds' toes here. I love the ideas of communicating in colloquialisms and experimenting with number expression. I'm not trying to rule anything else out by posting this.

Bernd 10/07/2019 (Mon) 10:01:43 [Preview] No.29520 del
Also, I should note, the characters marked with a '/' are those eliminated by spelling with other characters.

Bernd 10/07/2019 (Mon) 15:50:34 [Preview] No.29522 del
All right, I can work better with that. Well, "work", I'm quite busy nowadays.
Anyway I will have some reservations about the list. First which I've problem with is to use "e" to something which actually a derivative of "i" ([iː] real). The next is "u" as "ʌ" , then "c" as "k" which should be simply "k", and "c" should get "ts". Some other stuff too.
Ofc, I'll look into this list and make up my mind if I can live with these, as I can live with "s" - "s" and "sh" - ʃ.

>IPA [...] I hadn't heard of it before.
In primary school we learnt English with that. We had to write a vocabulary (there were special copybooks with pages divided in the middle) of words we had to digest in this order: in Hungarian - in English [IPA].
>So I guess now we assign characters to each sound.
You mean we build the alphabet now?

Bernd 10/07/2019 (Mon) 20:57:27 [Preview] No.29524 del
>You mean we build the alphabet now?
Unless ofcourse you want alterations. There is no rush. I just assumed it was fairly complete.

Bernd 10/08/2019 (Tue) 06:19:51 [Preview] No.29530 del
Just for reference.

Bernd 10/08/2019 (Tue) 09:32:39 [Preview] No.29532 del
Just to be clear, all I've done is strip English down to its' core. We can assign whatever characters we want to the phonetic sounds which makes the language cryptic.

For example:
c - k cry = x
e - iː real = y

Thus we have a language that reads like English but looks like gibberish.

The point of making it phonetic is to make it plainly readable because English pronunciation can depend on the word, so if we used a cipher on regular English we would need to translate the word back to English to be sure of what it is, but if we use a cipher on the phonetic sounds of English, we should have something encrypted but plainly readable.

Bernd 10/08/2019 (Tue) 09:34:19 [Preview] No.29533 del
/ph - f

Bernd 10/08/2019 (Tue) 18:28:16 [Preview] No.29540 del
That's breddy neat.
A nice little agglutinative language could be made out of Toki Pona.

Bernd 10/08/2019 (Tue) 20:15:08 [Preview] No.29542 del
I would wait a little, maybe the others - preferably not native English posters, we should have a couple such well hidden - has something on their end to add.

Bernd 10/09/2019 (Wed) 07:31:21 [Preview] No.29546 del

Hmm, I have same thoughts as >>29522 about "e" <-> "i:" and u <-> ʌ.

As non-native speaker, who often need to transliterate something into Latin script, "i:" is related to "i" more than to "e", and "ʌ" is more like "a". And "k"/"c" relation is ambiguous too. Other sounds look ok at first glance.

But this is Russian-related viewpoint and other people may think differently because of language specifics (our writing also relatively close to phonetics compared to English language).

Bernd 11/04/2019 (Mon) 21:17:11 [Preview] No.31282 del
vklhxaa eexr eeszw
x^ pxdxoow eexr vzbjr dj^ k^kd skhfx^w

Bernd 11/04/2019 (Mon) 23:16:09 [Preview] No.31284 del
(97.79 KB 512x512 1541095373832.png)
Is OP still in the thread?

Very nice start. Will be looking at this and the Python scripts later

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 06:47:01 [Preview] No.31289 del
I see you didn't just sit on your hands. Wanted to reply in Berndese but would have needed past tense.
I will study that thing.

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 15:49:07 [Preview] No.31291 del
Woah good shit vzsdw

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 19:24:55 [Preview] No.31294 del
eexr xr nzrn hjrn

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 19:26:17 [Preview] No.31297 del
I think I fucked it up.
eexr vz^ nzrn hjrn

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 19:27:58 [Preview] No.31298 del
why use other bernd language than esperanton?

lernu esperanton

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 19:29:27 [Preview] No.31299 del
I'm sorry burger but esperanto is dead.
Long live berndese!

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 19:34:06 [Preview] No.31300 del

But at least desperanto is easier to read.

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 19:38:04 [Preview] No.31301 del
I guess so, but it's still fun to have a fqdmk^qc for us, even if we don't use it

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 19:38:54 [Preview] No.31302 del
Also why does endchan say that I'm russian I'm ukranian, guess endchan is a Putin voter

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 19:48:21 [Preview] No.31303 del
Do you use .net or .org?

rq^c Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 19:52:42 [Preview] No.31304 del

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 20:16:05 [Preview] No.31305 del
net, trying org now

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 20:23:20 [Preview] No.31306 del
No difference I see.
Could be worse, could be SUball.

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 20:33:03 [Preview] No.31307 del
So as I see this isn't just using different letters but moving toward a more phonetical way of spelling and not following exactly the original English. Am I right?

Hungarobernd here btw, testing proxy on the Ukraine

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 21:17:28 [Preview] No.31310 del
Father is misspelled.

I have day off tomorrow, will try and expand the dictionary. Will translate all words itt.

Spot on hungarobernd

Bernd 11/05/2019 (Tue) 21:20:09 [Preview] No.31312 del
Yeah, that should be pqees.

Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 08:35:36 [Preview] No.31319 del
fjf! z^kk^ lz^d "rqmq^"
x^ bzhn xn qr rq^c xd eez wxboojdzsz^ pjs z^kk^

tzsz^ mk^w nzrn hjrn vzsdw!
x^ pxmsw z^kk^ k^kw vz^ eez pksrn nk^ nsx^ k^kxeeqk^n eez wxboojdzsz^

qbjswxaa nk^ ogden k^kz^ dz^w qvqk^n 1000 k^kswr nk^ gqt k^ksbxaa english
lzdz^ jt ogdens k^kswr wk^ djn qhfx^ nk^ q^ chan eej^

will post later with dictionary

Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 13:51:22 [Preview] No.31324 del
got a good start but that's all I can do for today.

Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 13:59:17 [Preview] No.31325 del
also, an interesting outcome of using phonetics is words that sound the same but are spelt differently
like: to too two, their there they're
a simple solution I've been doing is just keeping one of each homonym words in the dictionary so it always translates back to that word in english. open to suggestions though.

Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 18:17:22 [Preview] No.31327 del
qmnzsdq^nxtfx xn bk^w vx skk/sj^? Germ säge = saw
took me a while to translate, then reply, fjf

Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 19:08:03 [Preview] No.31328 del
(198.21 KB 600x892 5cbfbe9c4468b.jpeg)
i once toyed with the idea of making a script that will change all the words (in english) to close synonyms (or antonyms w/e) and ideally there would be a variable that can tune the "closeness" of synonyms (so you can also use more distant once for memetic effict)

its actually pretty easy to write you just need a quite big dictionary of words (as keys) and synonyms (as list of values) then basically:

for word in text:
output += random.choice(synDict[word])

its nearly all code

Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 19:09:08 [Preview] No.31329 del
*more distant ones

Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 19:23:15 [Preview] No.31331 del
So synDict is an associative array and "word" is a placeholder for an expression you want the synonym of?
That would be a long ass array.
And how do you decide which is the basic word (which gets to be the key) and which are just synonyms? Or every word is a key once and value several times simultaneously?

Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 19:24:20 [Preview] No.31332 del
Also a word can have different meanings, all meanings with it's own synonyms. How would the script differentiate?

Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 19:40:56 [Preview] No.31333 del
nohow i suppose

yes its a big [ass] dict (well, not actually, theres hardly more than 5k useful words in english, also im sure theres already dicts of synonyms (for stardict or something) or it can be parsed/ripped from dictionary sites online.

yes it can have multiple keys with sort-of same words as in both in keys and in values but i suppose that should not be a problem also keys are unique (i think)

it will be like this
k: (american) -> v: [fat, stupid, yankee]
k: (german) -> v: [kraut, nazi]
k: (nazi) -> v: [german, kraut]

etc, in theory you just need make sure that the keys are unique and then pick random values (also, some online dicts of synonyms have some form of closeness already, so this "closeness" variable you just need to pick either more first once (from the beginning of the list of values) or more distant ones (so, from the end of the list)

its not that complex, most of the work is to build a dictionary from something

Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 19:42:25 [Preview] No.31334 del
*with this "closeness" variable

Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 20:47:52 [Preview] No.31335 del
>And how do you decide which is the basic word (which gets to be the key) and which are just synonyms?

i think in the "dumb" mode it will just replace the word multiple times without checking something like this, so:

"german german german" will become "nazi kraut nazi"

but in more sophisticated modes its possible to map some words (say, when they used/being replaced for the first time) and then reuse this map:

"german german german" will be: "nazi nazi nazi"
"german german nazi nazi" will be: "nazi nazi kraut kraut"


Bernd 11/06/2019 (Wed) 20:56:02 [Preview] No.31336 del
imagine feeding a Russia Today article to this "filter"

might be ebin

also its possible to make a memetic dict with data from "urban dictionary" or something like this and filter say wikipedia with it

Bernd 11/07/2019 (Thu) 03:26:07 [Preview] No.31341 del
(68.37 KB 250x246 cupfrogs_3.png)
Pretty good thread going on. I was thinking about translating works of literature after the Bernedese language is more developed.

Maybe start with short novels and then move on to more extensive works.

Thoughts on this? The possibilities of this thing seems endless IMHO

Bernd 11/07/2019 (Thu) 06:22:52 [Preview] No.31342 del
I see a caveat in Berndese.
As is, it's good as a code, one can decipher it if he has the substitute table and knows about the phonetic rule. However writing in Berndese could result in reading, writing failures, difficulties in languages which use Latin script, since one would condition himself to use the Latin chars for different sounds. It's like when someone use a foreign language (largely inclusively tho) that could impair his ability to speak his native.

Yeah, that sounds ebin.

For starters some short stories, or jokes.

Bernd 11/07/2019 (Thu) 08:20:31 [Preview] No.31343 del
Yes, this is a fair consideration. I thought this over after the first comments were made about certain vowel sounds like i:. Ours is a unique situation where posters have different accents which affects pronunciation and thus a phonetic language. As such berndese cannot be read and written as English, to decipher a word it must be read aloud (or in head) which is slower than reading/writing the normal way. Similar to when some bernd writes "eggsburt" but it, in theory, shouldn't be any more difficult to decipher. The only way to know for certain is to try. An interesting side effect is seeing how bernd pronounces certain words, I can read what you write in your accent.

Bernd 11/07/2019 (Thu) 09:23:48 [Preview] No.31344 del
can we claim that english speakers are oppressing us so we need a place to build [s]Aspergia[/s] Berndia?

we are a group of people (and a minority) that english-speaking "normies" hate anyway

Bernd 11/07/2019 (Thu) 10:46:18 [Preview] No.31345 del
typical non english speaker, posted the thumbnail not the image! fjf

wxw z^kk^ lz^d rkk/rj^?
jfrj^ "qmnzsdq^nxtfx" k^kjr q^ fjaa k^ksw k^kzf wkd.
ks z^kk^ k^rxaa eez python wxboojdzsz^?

this sounds like fun.
You could use urban dictionary api. Just found this:

Bernd 11/07/2019 (Thu) 16:37:08 [Preview] No.31349 del
>I can read what you write in your accent.
Hory shit, I didn't even consider this. This is awsome, I could even learn proper Russian English accent!!!

Oh gonna decipher this soon.

Bernd 11/07/2019 (Thu) 17:40:40 [Preview] No.31350 del
>wxw z^kk^ lz^d rkk/rj^?
z^kzr, lx^ lxrnq^b
xnr bjdpz^kk^r^xaa wzn s = r zdw r = s

ks z^kk^ k^rxaa eez python wxboojdzsz^?
dj^, x^ nsx^ nk^ nrxpqs vx^ vx^ lx^rzmp nk^ mqn z^kk^r^w nk^ xn

vnt, dj^ r^ z - zero

Bernd 11/09/2019 (Sat) 02:22:10 [Preview] No.31380 del
another simple recipe for a bernd language is to use different layout for english keyboard when typing, for example actually typing in Colemak but having Qwerty layout set in OS/editor (for berndish transliteration). Learning colemak also benefits typing (and is fun), so in a way its useful (not sure if reading/writing qwerty -> colemak translit is useful too)

basically its normal english with different alphabet that can be typed quite fast on any computer (even without colemak layout) after few weeks of leaning, reading it is probably a lot more complicated however
you also can buy a colemak keyboard or glue some letters on your old one if you need it

for example:
qwerty: "they can't quite get this message"
colemak: "fhko caj'f qilfk tkf fhld mkddatk"

and there are already tools and online converter/decoder:

Bernd 11/09/2019 (Sat) 10:57:00 [Preview] No.31389 del
yes, using a cipher on english is a simple encryption method but it's not a 'language' and it cannot be read without deciphering due to the nature of english. Another interesting solution is pictographic encypted messages, something that was popular on 8ch/cyber and lain/cyb, but again tools must be used to decipher the code, it cannot be read. I'm sorry I cannot remember the tool used for the pictures but it was a firefox extension which was cool.

hah, yes, I had thought it would make it easier to remember but it could be equally confusing.
I don't know about you but I was able to read that first line without translating, certainly finding it easier to read than to write atm.
eez ee, aa, oo qdw tqk^fr ks lj^rn z^rz^

>ks z^kk^ k^rxaa eez python wxboojdzsz^?
z^kzr, j^dfz^ nk^ gzfh k^kxee sx^nxaa
z^kk^ ks gzfhxaa lz^ k^kxee eez wxboojdzsz^ vx^ sx^nxaa. x^ fx^b "nrx^pqs"

>vnt, dj^ r^
? r^?

gqk^k z^rz^ ks z^kk^ fksdxaa?

Bernd 11/09/2019 (Sat) 11:17:29 [Preview] No.31390 del
x^ ql fjsw ooxnhjrn, rz^ eez hqk^ks jt lx^ jnxrl, gz^ks lz^ rhksc


Bernd 11/09/2019 (Sat) 20:19:29 [Preview] No.31405 del
>? r^?
x^ xlhsjtx^r^w
x^ pkk^dw q rkk^dw lxrrxaa
x.c.: r^zw, r^zsj^, vkr^k^bk
bzdn z^kk^r^ r js nr
zdw xr^xs tsx^nxaa r^ wzd n^r^


Bernd 11/09/2019 (Sat) 22:44:19 [Preview] No.31408 del
Oh fugg this looks intredasting.

Bernd 11/14/2019 (Thu) 14:46:44 [Preview] No.31965 del
yes, this presented me with some thinking, well noticed. I'm against the use of '^' for anything other than the vowels but you are correct, special use cases need a z, not an s. For example 'spaz' which is not the same as spas or spats. I've chosen the 'i' character to represent this.

Also, I've made some updates that should make things easier. The scripts should be more user friendly now and I've expanded the dictionary. Please feel free to experiment. The bernd script will now allow you to spell words phonetically in english (with ^ indicators next to long vowels) and cipher them for you. Still not perfect yet and might be bugs so please give me feedback.

Bernd 11/14/2019 (Thu) 17:19:31 [Preview] No.31985 del
Ok, will look into it.

Bernd 11/14/2019 (Thu) 18:44:15 [Preview] No.32003 del
Btw writing haikus in Berndese will be more sane than in English.

Bernd 11/14/2019 (Thu) 19:09:45 [Preview] No.32008 del
nksd jp z^kjs nz^tz^
ck^kr bjdnsjf eez lz^wz^q
eeq^ gq^n k^kx^n hz^hf


Bernd 12/22/2019 (Sun) 19:23:47 [Preview] No.33311 del
Wrote very simple html/js implementation just for fun. It preserves markup and tries to be somewhat user friendly. May contain bugs too.

I've used python script as reference implementation, but did some thing differently.

Just open index.html in browser. Techically, berndese.js may be used separately, it isn't tied to any markup. It may require relatively modern browser (FF/chrome is ok, latest palemoon works).

Bernd 12/22/2019 (Sun) 20:15:16 [Preview] No.33313 del
Not bad. Will test it out.

Bernd 12/22/2019 (Sun) 20:36:03 [Preview] No.33314 del

And there is already a small bug - placeholder with "spell..." sits on wrong textarea. It doesn't break anything though.

Here is the updated version.

Bernd 12/22/2019 (Sun) 20:40:55 [Preview] No.33315 del
(51.08 KB 1052x704 angry_laptop.jpg)
Where were the testers????!!!

Bernd 12/22/2019 (Sun) 20:43:34 [Preview] No.33316 del

Testing are for the weak.

Bernd 12/22/2019 (Sun) 21:01:01 [Preview] No.33317 del
hah, I was going to say it was broken but 'spell text phonetically in english' was in the wrong box.

I like it very much. I didn't like having to import the separate regex library in the python script, plus your solution is much more elegant as it keeps the string rather than pulling bits out so you keep punctuation. However, I have found a bug with eng>bernd 'c' 'k' and 'f' 'ph'. I don't think this would be an issue if you just advise not to spell with 'k' or 'ph'.

I like the interface too but it needs some sort of mascot on the page. Berndese mascot?

tzsz^ mk^w k^ksb

Bernd 12/22/2019 (Sun) 21:01:50 [Preview] No.33318 del
oh lol, you posted whilst I was playing with it

Bernd 12/22/2019 (Sun) 21:53:22 [Preview] No.33320 del
Fun fact. We call nrx^pqs ooxpx^s. Although it's getting archaic.

Comfy to use.

Bernd 12/22/2019 (Sun) 23:07:54 [Preview] No.33322 del
>I didn't like having to import the separate regex library in the python script

There is nothing wrong in importing "re" module, because it is the part of standard library (and actually part of language as is). So, it is pure "vanilla" python without external dependencies.

>I have found a bug with eng>bernd 'c' 'k' and 'f' 'ph'.

I've used original translation table from python script v2 but put it into one big object, and swapped keys and values to get table for other side. But now I see that this is wrong, because variables with same key replace each other and some data is lost. I'll rewrite that part later maybe, and it will fix some problems.

Bernd 12/23/2019 (Mon) 02:51:15 [Preview] No.33334 del
It already exists and it's called Deutsch.

Bernd 12/23/2019 (Mon) 06:36:37 [Preview] No.33337 del
I spent some time trying to make the python work without regex but I'm just not skilled enough. I might take another swing, you have inspired me.

I looked at the code before testing and saw that might be an issue but honestly I don't think it's a problem. I do think it needs a little help button to explain the vowel sounds anyway, just mention there not to spell with k or ph.

Bernd 12/23/2019 (Mon) 23:26:08 [Preview] No.33366 del
>I spent some time trying to make the python work without regex

I don't recommend this. Replacement of multiple overlapping patterns is tedious task. For example, taking Berndese string "bk^k" and replacing it into English: first we replace "bk^k" with "q", but next we'll match "q" (it also exists in Berndese) and replace it into "a". So, translation is ruined. No sorting or other method would help.

To overcome this, you need to keep track of replaced substrings (start/end indexes), but it isn't fun too, because replacements have different length than matching pattern. So, in the end you'll need to create finite automation like in regex (DFA/NFA). It isn't impossible, but worth only in educational purposes and not an easy task at all.

Also here is updated version with better table for replacements and some small fixes.

Bernd 12/24/2019 (Tue) 07:12:43 [Preview] No.33368 del
That thumbnail is killing me.

Bernd 12/24/2019 (Tue) 08:15:01 [Preview] No.33370 del
(49.51 KB 960x720 slide_3.jpg)

Even regex thumbnails are hurtful.

Bernd 12/24/2019 (Tue) 14:17:47 [Preview] No.33393 del
chuckled, very good

yeah, i ended up with a spaghetti code head fuck and even my own comments became alien to me, deleted it in frustration and just went with regex solution. Might take another swing anyway, just because it got under my skin.

Works well, good stuff. still needs a mascot though.

Bernd 04/12/2020 (Sun) 01:25:06 [Preview] No.35846 del
I don't know how far you guys have come, but I recommend just using the IPA for the script.

Bernd 04/12/2020 (Sun) 07:47:17 [Preview] No.35847 del
It's usable as is now, and we used it quite a lot.
I still haven't cracked the board tho.

Bernd 04/12/2020 (Sun) 09:50:16 [Preview] No.35849 del
So input IPA instead of english for translation? That's actually not a bad idea, though not sure how I would personally use it. I should leave that to someone who has experience in using IPA.

I got to 816 words translated between me and hungry-ball. I figured I would wait to get to 1000 before doing a release with py2exe. I think though, we can do some in browser translation thanks to rus-ball and a greasemonkey script. Just how complex we can have it I'm not sure because I've not tried but I figured if I can free up some time soon I might get something done.

Bernd 04/12/2020 (Sun) 21:50:09 [Preview] No.35878 del
>So input IPA instead of english for translation?
Oh no, I mean for the letters used to represent sounds when the language is typed/written.
For example, if a word includes a "TH" sound, such as the one used in "that", it would be written with an IPA "ð"

Bernd 04/13/2020 (Mon) 19:14:23 [Preview] No.35897 del
why not the slov-sound-spelling alphabet?

Bernd 04/13/2020 (Mon) 20:55:25 [Preview] No.35899 del
I'm not familiar

Bernd 04/15/2020 (Wed) 16:04:19 [Preview] No.35945 del
Sorry for the delay. It's very similar to IPA but a little more complete. There is a fantastic article in kohlzine 13 & 14. Well worth a read if you are thinking IPA anyway.

Bernd 05/20/2021 (Thu) 16:41:23 [Preview] No.43724 del
Berndese supa sekrit lang.

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